tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post6924331702808455216..comments2024-03-29T02:30:24.590+11:00Comments on eclectica: the death of a fugitivekyliehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08964475783207438103noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-78009505413075573322011-05-08T10:52:16.516+10:002011-05-08T10:52:16.516+10:00Snow, I agree completely about the deism that perm...Snow, I agree completely about the deism that permeates American politics, and frankly I find it alarming as well. I certainly don't support it. Your point is well made and well taken.<br /><br />I'm not sure why we (or some of us) are so arrogant--not necessarily a demonstration of superiority, but some embedded psychology of fuckit, i'm gonna do my own thing!<br /><br />This was very interesting actually.Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14061893047279652658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-80369525917813984222011-05-08T04:17:43.073+10:002011-05-08T04:17:43.073+10:00Leah said: "I sure as heck think America and ...Leah said: "I sure as heck think America and Americans are arrogant. It's our thing!"<br /><br />So, do you see our arrogance as implying that we really are superior? I think a lot of Americans do.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-49801741427703692632011-05-08T04:07:06.683+10:002011-05-08T04:07:06.683+10:00Leah said: "In matters of god or not-god I wo...Leah said: "In matters of god or not-god I would never weigh in. It's a personal journey."<br /><br />The politics of the American right-wing (like the politics of much of the Middle East) is very much tied to their understanding of what god wants. If they were content simply to go to church on Sundays, I would have no problem with them, but their religion permeates America. When people say that religion is a personal matter, I assume that they don't follow the news.<br /><br />As for Kylie being harsh (or not), her stated intent was to depict how people from other countries see America, and based upon the blogs I read and the comments I receive, she was right. I don't recall a single non-American disagreeing with her. <br /><br />Thanks, Leah, for your comments--and thanks, Kylie, for hosting this discussion.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-18143001246764827652011-05-08T00:41:58.025+10:002011-05-08T00:41:58.025+10:00p.s. Kylie, you're probably right in thinking ...p.s. Kylie, you're probably right in thinking folks took the "idiot" statement as personal opinion, but hey. Funnily, I don't take any exception to the term "arrogant," because I sure as heck think America and Americans are arrogant. It's our thing!Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14061893047279652658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-89275963933624080012011-05-08T00:22:50.897+10:002011-05-08T00:22:50.897+10:00I love Kylie. She's one of the people I respe...I love Kylie. She's one of the people I respect the very most on the interwebs and in life. In fact, I'm traveling three thousand miles to meet her in a month! (of course, she is traveling umpteen more miles, but hey, we won't quibble). I still don't think using the words "stupid" "idiot" etc is gentle, but then again, we can agree to disagree. But also, disagreement is the soul of political discussion, and dare I say, very American! I don't really think my disagreements were harsh, just impassioned. <br /><br />Btw, in reference to something you mentioned awhile back, I don't consider political protest to be anything like treason, for baal's sake, rather the backbone of American society and democracy (although again, I don't have to agree with it!!! and I can certainly say my disagreement!!!) and I have total respect for the notion of atheism. One of my best friends is an atheist LOLOL just kidding I have many many atheist and agnostic friends and family members. In matters of god or not-god I would never weigh in. It's a personal journey.<br /><br />That wasn't as tangential as it would seem--I think there are places I like to weigh in (the political) and places I don't (god or gog or baal or the Great Not or whatever).Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14061893047279652658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-91949864524748384252011-05-07T18:05:49.630+10:002011-05-07T18:05:49.630+10:00Leah said: "Snow, I think that when one posts...Leah said: "Snow, I think that when one posts a post like this, a post which was rather harshly stated..."<br /><br />WHAT?! If this wasn't gentle and understated, then I don't know what gentle and understated look like. Kylie is a lamb, I'm telling you, an absolute lamb. The woman wouldn't blow a butterfly off course if she was a hurricane--or a typhoon, or whatever they call them down there. Why, she wouldn't squash a fly if she sat on it.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-63211190586843446602011-05-07T16:05:29.878+10:002011-05-07T16:05:29.878+10:00hmmm, i'm compelled to put my final word in he...hmmm, i'm compelled to put my final word in here but also understand that it probably wonrt be final :)<br />i did feel very confronted by some of the comments here and i didnt expect them so yes, i was shocked but at the same time i understand that i asked for it to a degree.<br /><br />i dont hate america, hate very rarely enters my emotional range and when it has it is under extreme provocation and in the face of PERSONAL pain so that was a bit of a whammy.<br /><br />i dont regard the individuals and the nation as the same thing so nobody should think that.<br /><br />i made a statement about how i think the world sees america and i suspect that was taken as my personal opinion. i will take ownership of calling the US arrogant and i stand by that but at the same time i recognise that a measure of arrogance is often necessary for success.<br /><br />snow, i appreciate your support in a situation where i probably bit off more than i could chew.<br /><br />leah, only a true friend will take the trouble to make a respectful disagreement so thank you for that.<br /><br />the whole discussion has been a good one and it is the reason i fell in love with blogging<br /><br />xoxkyliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08964475783207438103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-45447190552214381762011-05-07T14:34:23.734+10:002011-05-07T14:34:23.734+10:00Snow, I think that when one posts a post like this...Snow, I think that when one posts a post like this, a post which was rather harshly stated (whether true or not), one must expect to get some harsh and/or defensive remarks in response!<br /><br />That's just the way it goes.Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-86061858829062948202011-05-07T09:47:33.501+10:002011-05-07T09:47:33.501+10:00Leah said: "Kylie, why am I uncontrollably ma...Leah said: "Kylie, why am I uncontrollably making these strings of comments? "<br /><br />Up late? Too much wine? Boundless enthusiasm? All of the above?<br /><br />As for whether anyone blasted Kylie, I guess it depends upon your definition of the word blasted. I thought that some of the comments were unjustifiably harsh, and I also thought that Kylie was shocked and hurt by them. Oddly enough, I wrote a similar post about the same time Kylie did, and I don't recall getting a single negative response (maybe I did, and just forgot it), but then my readers are used to me trashing god and country.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-81349999153423502352011-05-06T19:55:19.725+10:002011-05-06T19:55:19.725+10:00lol, leah you are making strings of comments beca...lol, leah you are making strings of comments because you are passionate about it :)kyliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08964475783207438103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-52553274077866694692011-05-06T13:36:25.640+10:002011-05-06T13:36:25.640+10:00Kylie, why am I uncontrollably making these string...Kylie, why am I uncontrollably making these strings of comments?Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-42279907191451574932011-05-06T13:35:52.803+10:002011-05-06T13:35:52.803+10:00I hardly think anyone blasted Kylie!I hardly think anyone blasted Kylie!Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-72283528239428214712011-05-06T13:34:58.752+10:002011-05-06T13:34:58.752+10:00Polite discourse is a good thing! I don't mind...Polite discourse is a good thing! I don't mind people disagreeing with me, I just don't like the words "stupid" and "idiot."Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-9099416110360419622011-05-06T13:29:53.682+10:002011-05-06T13:29:53.682+10:00Snow, I think you missed the point...Snow, I think you missed the point...Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-51846417296772480032011-05-06T03:27:54.213+10:002011-05-06T03:27:54.213+10:00"i'm probably not qualified to judge"..."i'm probably not qualified to judge"<br /><br />Kylie, don't back down just because people blasted you. They don't like you criticizing American because you're a foreigner, and they don't like me criticizing America because I'm an American--and therefore a traitor. In other words, DON'T CRITICIZE AMERICA, ANYONE, EVER. You spoke the truth as you saw it, and the problem wasn't with what you said but with the fact that you have a reader base that's not used to you talking about such things, and it made some of them uncomfortable, that's all.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-23172246032467843342011-05-05T22:10:35.114+10:002011-05-05T22:10:35.114+10:00well, snow, i kinda expected you to say that.
i...well, snow, i kinda expected you to say that.<br />i'm probably not qualified to judge, even though i did :)kyliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08964475783207438103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-51101953960351831462011-05-05T21:31:12.198+10:002011-05-05T21:31:12.198+10:00Kylie, aren't all three of the things you ment...Kylie, aren't all three of the things you mentioned facts?Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-33212626727731517022011-05-05T20:18:14.863+10:002011-05-05T20:18:14.863+10:00thanks everyone for your comments.
snow, the snak...thanks everyone for your comments.<br /><br />snow, the snakes are not a criticism, they are fact and there is no arguing with that.<br /><br />i hear regular criticism of australias drinking culture which is admittedly shameful and dangerous and costly but i dont neccessarily like to hear it.<br /><br />and our tradesmen are by some accounts the worst in the world. there are some shonks but there are also some great craftsmen out there with their shirts offkyliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08964475783207438103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-75896533043850494792011-05-05T03:26:21.085+10:002011-05-05T03:26:21.085+10:00Btw, I was *obviously* not saying America should *...Btw, I was *obviously* not saying America should *never* be criticized. I'm objecting rather to a. the blanket indictment of words like "stupid" and b. the strange concept of the USA as a giant Borg.Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-60851540490451379982011-05-05T03:21:03.033+10:002011-05-05T03:21:03.033+10:00I will even venture to say that I *never* miss the...I will even venture to say that I *never* miss the point, at least not in online discourse. How's that for arrogance?Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-69600415341815720162011-05-05T03:18:55.801+10:002011-05-05T03:18:55.801+10:00I didn't miss the point, Snow. I rarely miss ...I didn't miss the point, Snow. I rarely miss the point.Leahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-44614260886025120522011-05-05T01:22:16.895+10:002011-05-05T01:22:16.895+10:00P.S. "i will not countenance any criticism of...P.S. "i will not countenance any criticism of my country from anyone who i would regard as an outsider, even if they are correct."<br /><br />Then this would be a bad time to bring up the poisonous snakes?<br /><br />Look, kiddo, America's arrogance and stupidity affects the entire world, so I would consider it eminently open to criticism by the entire world. The people whom I become impatient with are those non-Americans who ONLY criticize America, thereby engaging in the same kind of arrogance and self-righteousness of which they accuse America.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-25783504688888919332011-05-05T01:16:28.249+10:002011-05-05T01:16:28.249+10:00I think that some of your American readers miss th...I think that some of your American readers miss the point in reminding you that people with diverse values live in America. No doubt the same is true of Communist China, yet the government of that country is no less culpable for the evil it does. If only those countries in which everyone held the same values were open to criticism, then no country would ever be criticized.Snowbrushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00436087215476479042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-59167275934296517952011-05-04T23:53:03.115+10:002011-05-04T23:53:03.115+10:00I don't see anything wrong with criticising wh...I don't see anything wrong with criticising what you see as the repellent practices of another country. Every country has plenty of them, after all. As long as you appreciate the good things as well and don't just write off a whole nation with some grotesque stereotype.nickhttp://nickhereandnow.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9017882226857032208.post-87552367034735998292011-05-04T22:55:59.147+10:002011-05-04T22:55:59.147+10:00Kylie, I wouldn't want someone to hesitate in ...Kylie, I wouldn't want someone to hesitate in posting whatever they feel! Or whatever they feel like posting! I just felt compelled to post my own statement (it's the same one I always trot out in response to certain types of criticisms, but I do mean it). You should post what you like, and your friends will still love you, they just might have to rebut! Hey, it keeps things lively.<br /><br />love,<br /><br />LeahLeahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15653790703354598075noreply@blogger.com